ECOBEE 4 + HRV + Humidifier

[grinthock]

Good day, looking for help from the experts. 

I have installed an ECOBEE 4,  ideally I would like to wiring it to both my HRV (control is right beside) and my humidifier (All in the basement)

Here is some info about my install.

Standard Propane furnace with A/C - had a standard 7 day honeywell before, replaced with the Ecobee,  I didn't have a "C" wire but there was an Orange wire unused at both ends, so i used that for "C"

The HRV is a VANEE with a "Bronze" controller that has a dehumidistat with off/min/max options.  4 wires,  Y R G B are wired into it - with one free, it's right beside the EcoBee 4.     FYI - I am 99% sure that the HRV isn't interlocked with the furnace, which I understand is a bit of a no no,  when i turn on my HRV on high - the furnance fan doesn't turn on -- which is a problem I am told.    I am also told, the Ecobee can fix that by triggering the furnace fan when the HRV is triggered --- but i'm not against fixing the HRV properly and having it handle that.

The humidifer is a standard one from home depot, that mounted on the side of the furnace, it has a humidistat in the cold air return and the mechanical kite switch, uses it's own AC power supply right now, all separate.   I install this myself some time ago, works fine.

Looking for guidance to get the HRV and Humidifier both connected to the Ecobee4.

Thanks in advance for your very many years of experiencing helping me out.

[Admin]

The Ecobee 4 is the same as the Ecobee 3 in the sense it can only control a humidifier or HRV, but not both.  I had hoped they would have included a second set of dry contacts, in the latest version, so you can control both humidifier and HRV.

Using the Ecobee 4 with the humidifier is a good option as it has window frost protection.

I'm not 100% sure if the HRV setup will turn the furnace fan on automatically.  Otherwise you should look at interlocking the furnace to the HRV, using the 3 wire method.

[grinthock]

So that's fine, my only issue is right now I'm short some wire to get that done and running wire to that location isn't going to be trivial.  I may need to do some wall surgery to get what I need as I only have one spare wire over at the HRV control available and hay doesn't really go down to he humidifier anyway.

The documentation is very discerning because it shows an "equipment interface" with ACC1 2 and 3 yet the unit only has ACC1

[Admin]

Your Ecobee 4 should have ACC- and ACC+ terminals.

The manual I found online refers to the terminals on the HRV as being R and G, but on your Vanee you likely need to use B and G (You don't need to use Y and R).  Connect them to the ACC terminals and during setup, select 2-wire (ACC+, ACC-) accesory on the thermostat screen.

[pld74]

I have an ECOBEE 4 and Vanee 65H HRV. Any guidance on how to connect it to the ECOBEE 4 and FURNACE? I have Air Con installed. The Vanee is plugged into a 120V circuit and works if I manually switch it. Thanks

[Admin]

You would need to have at least 7 wires going from the thermostat to the furnace.  More if you're wired for 2 stage cooling or heating.

Is the HRV in the same room as the furnace?  You can disconnect the wires on the HRV Y, R, G and B terminals.  They go upstairs to the main HRV control.  Now run a new 2 wire from the G and B terminals on the HRV over to the furnace and connect them to two unused wires coming from the thermostat.  Connect the G and B wires to the Ecobee 4 ACC- and ACC+ terminals.  Then setup the Ecobee ventilator settings.

The HRV should already be interlocked with the furnace so the furnace fan starts anytime the HRV is turned on.  The Ecobee 4 will start the fan when the HRV runs so this interlock wire is not necessary.  Instead of buying and installing new wiring just use it.  There should be 3 wires coming from the HRV NC, NO and C terminals.   Disconnect them and connect 2 of those wires to the HRV G and B terminals.  Now inside the furnace disconnect the wires coming from the HRV.  2 wires should be connected to the furnace R and G terminals and the third wire maretted with the thermostat G wire.  Remove the marette and reconnect the thermostat G wire to the furnace G terminal.  Now use the same 2 wires you connected to the HRV G and B terminals and connect them to the thermostat ACC- and ACC+ terminals. 

Again, you would need 7 wires coming from the thermostat to the furnace for this to work.  If you only had 5 wires and the HRV main control is close to the thermostat, you could extend 2 of the HRV control wires over to the thermostat.  You just need to make a connection between the HRV G and B terminals and the Ecobee 4 ACC- and ACC+ terminals.

[walker]

Trying to wire up a Ecobee 4 with a Venmar AVS 1.0 COnstructo model,  do  I just wire the ACC+ To R and ACC- To G on the HRV terminal block, and the Ecobee will do the rest?

[Admin]

The ACC wires connect to the G and B terminals on the HRV.  It doesn't matter which ACC wire connects to which terminal.  You can also eliminate the HRV interlock wiring as the Ecobee will start the furnace fan when the HRV starts.

[walker]

The ACC wires connect to the G and B terminals on the HRV.  It doesn't matter which ACC wire connects to which terminal.  You can also eliminate the HRV interlock wiring as the Ecobee will start the furnace fan when the HRV starts.

Ok I'll try that.  Now do I leave the speed button on the bottom on off as it would when used with a controller, or do I select the low or high speed and the ecobee just turns it on and off?

[Admin]

Leave that off otherwise the HRV would run 24/7.  The Ecobee will start and stop the HRV but will only run the one speed, which is fine.

[walker]

Very good, my guess is it defaults to low speed?

[Admin]

That I'm not 100% sure of.  I know with Lifebreathe you can chose which speed to use but I don't think you can with Venmar / Vanee.

[walker]

That I'm not 100% sure of.  I know with Lifebreathe you can chose which speed to use but I don't think you can with Venmar / Vanee.

It's definitely running on high speed, now my only issue is it seems to be running 24 hours a day, I was sure I set it to run 20mins/hour in the ecobee settings

[Admin]

There's a dehumidification setting under SYSTEM, HRV, DEHUMIDIFY IN WINTER.  Make sure it's disabled or it may be running until the humidity lowers.

[walker]

There's a dehumidification setting under SYSTEM, HRV, DEHUMIDIFY IN WINTER.  Make sure it's disabled or it may be running until the humidity lowers.

Yes it's disabled already.

[Admin]

That's weird.  I wired my Vanee HRV B and G terminals to the ACC terminals on the Ecobee and it seems to cycle fine.  I did notice weird run times though.  I expected it to run 20min every hour consecutively, but after I checked the logs it seemed to run the HRV for 2 minutes, then it would stop and keep doing this throughout the day.

If you jumper B and G at the HRV does the HRV run then stop once the jumper is removed?

[walker]

That's weird.  I wired my Vanee HRV B and G terminals to the ACC terminals on the Ecobee and it seems to cycle fine.  I did notice weird run times though.  I expected it to run 20min every hour consecutively, but after I checked the logs it seemed to run the HRV for 2 minutes, then it would stop and keep doing this throughout the day.

If you jumper B and G at the HRV does the HRV run then stop once the jumper is removed?

I will try that.  The manual shows to wire between R and G and not B and G, I wonder if that is it? It's not running all the time but it looks to be running 30-40 mins every hour.

[Admin]

It's definitely B and G to run the Vanee.  We install the lite touch controls and use B, G and Y.  The Y is only to power the LED lights on the control.  We never use R.

We install the odd Deco control and wire B, G, Y and R.  To be honest I have no idea what R does.  I believe it might have something to do with a dehumidification mode.

[walker]

It's definitely B and G to run the Vanee.  We install the lite touch controls and use B, G and Y.  The Y is only to power the LED lights on the control.  We never use R.

We install the odd Deco control and wire B, G, Y and R.  To be honest I have no idea what R does.  I believe it might have something to do with a dehumidification mode.

Very good, and I'm still the switching it on and off is still being done by the ecobee,. Just need to figure out why it's running so long.  It's bringing way too much humidity running that long on warm days,

[ecowhat]

It's definitely B and G to run the Vanee.  We install the lite touch controls and use B, G and Y.  The Y is only to power the LED lights on the control.  We never use R.

We install the odd Deco control and wire B, G, Y and R.  To be honest I have no idea what R does.  I believe it might have something to do with a dehumidification mode.

I know this thread is a little old, but I think it is still relevant. I have been searching and searching and can't find info about the difference between B and R wires. My Venmar Novofit 2.0ES installation manual doesn't offer any help from what I can tell. Ecobee troubleshooting says to use R and G for ventilators (https://support.ecobee.com/hc/en-us/articles/360023859852-Troubleshooting-accessory-installations). I'm concerned because you seem to know your stuff and recommend connecting B and G instead.

Can anyone offer any insight here? What behaviour differences can I expect using B vs R with my HRV? TIA

[Admin]

I was told R has to do with certain controls that offer humidity options.  We install thousands of Vanee 65H HRV with the lite touch control and wire the B, G and Y terminals and Y is only to power the light.

As far a I know closing R and B or R and G will not do anything.

100% you use B and G to run the HRV.  You can just twist the wires together and see the HRV will start.  You will only be able to control one speed and not both with the Ecobee.

[ecowhat]

Thanks for the quick response. I will reconnect Ecobee with the B wire.

Since my previous post, I have seen that some HRV manuals show main controls that are wired without R (only B, G and Y). Perhaps R provides a trigger to toggle recirculation mode with a capable controller (e.g. Altitude, which I have disconnected).

Now to figure out how to determine and set the best fan speed...

[holyspectral]

100% you use B and G to run the HRV.  You can just twist the wires together and see the HRV will start.  You will only be able to control one speed and not both with the Ecobee.

Sorry for keeping bringing up this old thread.

I'm trying to re-wire my Vanee HRV 90H-V with ecobee 5 in order to make it run in low speed by default instead of high speed.  However, the HRV's installation guide, speed is controlled by the same 2 wires connected to B/G.  Is it possible to run it in low speed when wired with Ecobee?

[Admin]

I'm not 100% sure and don't want to lead you astray.  I think the low runs on 62V and the high on 120V.

If you look at the attached wiring diagram, at the bottom it talks about changing speeds.  See my red arrows.  I'm not sure if this applies to your 90H or only the 90H-V+ model.

Vanee has pretty decent tech support.  1-800-567-3855.

They can likely tell you how to force low speed operation only.

Let us know what you find!

[tonypet]

Hi.  Apologies if this was already addressed.  I recently read that if using an HRV,  "Customers used to a drafty old home expect to need a humidifier, but we try to discourage the use of them".  I am not sure if I agree, and I am not sure what climate they are located.  I am in Toronto, Canada with many wooden floors and cabinets in the house.

That being said, I have an Ecobee3.  I currently have it setup to my Aprilaire Evaporative humidifier, but I do have a manual control available to easily reinstall (although I would consider an automatic control, based on your answer below).  I have available wiring to easily connect to my Vanee 190H HRV (2-wire to B & G wires -thank you!).   The HRV only has a manual switch on the unit, so I would require a control panel.

The question is, if I can only connect ONE device to my Ecobee3, is it more advantageous to connect the HRV or the Humidifier to the Ecobee and install a separate control for the other unit?  (Assuming I want the best setup, and I am not against buying a new control unit, if need be.)

Many thanks and your help is much appreciated!!

Tony

[Admin]

The Ecobee can control an HRV or humidifier but not both.

The Ecobee will only control 1 of the HRV fan speeds and has a good humidifier frost protection option so I would use the Ecobee to control the humidifier.  The Vanee Lite Touch Control #40270 is cheap to buy and would need 3 wires.  B, G and Y.

[tonypet]

Thanks for your advice.

I think I will need to wire an interlock from the HRV to the furnace fan, in that case (the HRV is just powered in place and ducted in).

I wish there was a controller with more options than the bronze and bronze lite, but I think I have a basic HRV installed 190H model 1601608.

A quick look at the instruction manual online for the controller shows I will need to wire the yellow to OL as my unit may be older (2007) and there is no connector on Y.

Thanks for your help!

[tonypet]

I am a bit lost.  as this is an older unit, and the manual for this 190H 1601608 HVR says it can be "interlocked with existing furnace without adding extra relay".

Based on the attached picture, which only has wiring for the toggle switch, how would I wire this to the furnace to be interlocked to the fan??

thank you.

[Admin]

Well you may decide to use the Ecobee to control the HRV then so you won't need to install interlock wiring.  The Ecobee will turn on the furnace fan when the HRV starts. 

Look where the control is connected to the B, G and Y terminals.  Those terminals are usually on the outside of the unit, not on the control board.  There should also be NC, NO and C terminals that you use to interlock the furnace fan.  Usually there's a green molex plug that all these wires connect to.

You should use a 3 wire to interlock the HRV and furnace fan.

Remove the G wire that comes from the thermostat off the furnace control board.  Connect a wire from HRV C to the furnace control board G.

Marette a wire from HRV NC to the thermostat G wire you removed from the furnace control board.

Connect a wire from HRV NO to the furnace control board R.

[tonypet]

Thank you very much!

[tonypet]

Sorry for the LATE reply, but I needed to order a new damper for my HRV and just received it.  I am doing the connection now.

One question- to do the Three Wire Interlock setup you described, can I (or do I) leave the existing toggle control switch  (LOW- OFF- HIGH)  connected with the Black, Green, Red wires, or ONLY have wires connected to the furnace control board and remove these?

Thx in advance.

[tonypet]

And lastly, I understand the three wire setup/connection you described to interlock to the furnace fan, BUT I do not know how to connect the HRV to the Ecobee3.

Do I use either or both of the Acc+ or Acc- connectors on the Ecobee3 and connect to what??

Correction!

Please see the picture of the circuit board a few posts above for current wiring.  I have attached a copy of the un-wired circuit board on this post.

I was mistaken. There are no NC, NO and C terminals, just B, G, R wires in their same positions.  My Circuit board has Terminals: B,G,R,Y, OL, OC, I, F, F.  (B is in the #9 position).

I have THREE terminals B, G, and R  (currently wired with Black, Green and Red wires. I then have THREE MORE terminals available (listed, listed as OVERRIDE Switch)  (the #3,4,5 spots on the unit terminal connector of the circuit board). 

There are NO TERMINALS to connect a wire to the 1,2, and 6 spots (shown as F, F, and Y respectively). 

is it possible to somehow Interlock the B,G, and R wires to the Furnace Blower, AND double up the B and G terminals to the Acc+ and Acc- terminals of the Ecobee3 (to control the HRV)?  Or do I have to follow the "Alternate Interlock wiring diagram" (attached), as I have no terminals on the Fs spots?

I found this wiring diagram for the 190H unit that looks consistent with the above. (attached PDF)

Hopefully this is not confusing.  Any help is very much appreciated.

[tonypet]

I found this wiring diagram for the 190H unit that looks consistent with the above.